A Conversation with a Friend and Political Ally about the 2016 Prez Race

With all due respect (and for the record, I respect you quite a bit), I have chosen to email you to respond to your recent Facebook comments to my FB wall regarding a news report pertaining to the Clinton Foundation. Your FB comments are highlighted in red below…

What is wrong with you, Dom??

What is wrong with all of the people on the left who are fervently voting for an extreme right winger named Hillary Clinton? She supported the Iraq war (and has no desire to end the endless Afghan war, or the many other Middle East wars the US has gotten involved in). As Secretary of State Hillary used Bush/Cheney-style false intelligence as justification for the militarist aggression/assault on Libya. In other words, she fully supports the ruinous “War on Terror,” which would more accurately be called the “War to Endlessly Fund the Pentagon and Create More People Who Hate the US.”

Her extreme warmongering beliefs ALONE disqualifies her as someone anyone on the left should EVER support. Have we lost all sense of humanitarianism to be in a nation that has criminally intervened, bombed and killed hundreds of thousands of civilians for 16 YEARS in the Middle East? And now have allegedly peace-loving members of our political left fervently supporting a prez candidate who promises to ramp up these endless wars even more?13537702_10209382570424144_6609076702380662562_n

But wait, there’s more…

She supported the Patriot Act in 2001, and regularly supports other domestic spying proposals and civil liberties violations.

She was, according to the NYT, by far the biggest militarist and interventionist of all presidential candidates in 2016 (she is, unsurprisingly, supported by many nationally prominent Republican hawks, including Kissinger).

She was instrumental in fomenting a right wing coup in Honduras. Now, indigenous rights activists are being murdered by the regime.

She claims to be in support of immigration but as Secretary of State called for the deportation of children who were refugees from the murderous unrest in central and south America.

She supported NAFTA; the Clinton’s “Two-For-The-Price-Of-One” presidency’s so-called Welfare reform act — The Personal Responsibility and Work Opportunity Reconciliation Act of 1996 (PRWORA) — an act that cast more women and children into poverty than any event since the Great Depression.

She has been corrupted by huge sums of money from military contractors. Combined with her militaristic views, she is highly likely to pour even MORE money into the obscenely bloated Pentagon than Obama did (Obama set all-time US records for money going to the Pentagon). The US ALREADY spends more on the military than the next 8 nations in the world who spend the most on the military).

She supports the death penalty. She termed minority youth “super predators” while shilling for the Clinton administration’s Jim Crow 2.0 omnibus crime bill i.e., Violent Crime Control and Law Enforcement Act of 1994 — a racist piece of legislation that was the origin of the U.S. prison industrial complex. She reaped rewards for that years later when the largest private prison industry financed her senate campaign and both her presidential runs.

She served as a shill, lawyer and lobbyist for Walmart, Tyson foods, and the environmental destructive practices of the Arkansas timber industry. As a reward she was given a cushy spot on Walmart’s board, a paid position that requires no work, just the use of her name on letterheads.

She unconditionally supports the Israeli government.

She supports the US continuing to spend a disproportionate amount of funding on NATO (way more than other members of NATO).

She is a strong supporter of the utterly failed, ruinous war on drugs.

She is silent on the pressing need to revitalize passenger rail in the US.

She supports the Keystone XL pipeline.

As Secretary of State she organized the multinational corporate engineers for TPP, the trade deal that will kill the environment when combined with TiSA and TTiP and CETA, all of which Clinton helped organize, even though she is dodging it for campaign purposes.

She supports offshore oil drilling.

She supported the 2006 border fence legislation.

In the primaries in 2016, she raised over $20.3 million in Super PAC dollars, and $38.8 million in large donor contributions, including from Big Pharma, Big Insurance, and the for-profit medical lobby.

Her personal net worth is $21.5 million. The Clinton family now has something on the order of $200 million. She is, in other words, clearly a 1 percenter.

When she ran for president in 2008, she supported the second amendment, stood by her vote in support of the Iraq war, and opposed same sex marriage.

As a Young Republican, she worked for Barry Goldwater’s 1964 presidential campaign.

When the minimum wage was raised in Haiti to 61 cents an hour, the U.S. Department of State, under Hillary Clinton, intervened on behalf of the corporate garment industry exploiting defacto slave labor and had the rate changed back to 31 cents.

She supports fracking.

She opposes reinstating Glass Steagall (or other Wall St regulations). She supported much banking deregulation that crashed the global economy in 08; moreover, the Clinton family has grown wealthy due to the quid quo pro involved.

In sum, Hillary is a great example of a “Rockefeller Republican” from the 70s.

Anyone who can look at the above list and tell me it is NOT a list of Republican positions has a much different definition of Republican than I have. Or maybe our only major party choices this year are Republican Party (which now includes the Democrats) or MANIAC Party?

I can’t stand to see you bad mouthing Hillary on everything, and hardly even mentioning Trump.

I can’t stand seeing people on the left on FB mindlessly supporting a right winger like Hillary (the Rush Limbaugh “Dittoheads” of the left). Every day I get so sick of this that I vow to leave FB until the election is over. I am disgusted by the thought that so many Democrats have become Repubs in what they are willing to support or disregard (pro-war, pro drug laws, pro-fracking, pro-wall street, pro-corporations, stick-our-heads-in-the-sand, etc. – it is NOT okay to support a long list of right wing ideas because you fear an opponent of a candidate). Like supporters of Bush, Romney, McCain, etc., Hillary supporters hardly ever mention the enormous list of right-wing flaws Hillary has. A left-wing gay rights friend of mine puts it well: “Can we please stop talking about Trump? We all know he’s a fucking idiot and I don’t care to hear anything more about him. Instead can we talk about how corrupt Hillary is, and always has been, so that we can hold her accountable for when she unfortunately becomes President? Everyone seems to have forgotten just how corrupt she is. And even with BBC’s and CNN’s recently published leaks of Hillary accepting money from Wall Street no one seems to be talking about it. Why? Doesn’t it bother you that she’s a liar, thief and crook just like most politicians before her? Doesn’t it bother you that she was on the Board for Walmart from 1986 to 1992 and served as their legal advisor? Doesn’t it bother you that she accepted money from Monsanto, Goldman Sachs and foreign dictators that give no basic human rights to their citizens? Doesn’t it bother you that she is OKAY WITH FRACKING AND DOESN’T WANT TO BAN IT!? Doesn’t it bother you that she’s been involved in scandal after scandal since day one?”


The Clinton foundation has an A rating from the two impartial, foremost Charity raters in the world

You might want to have a look at a documentary on YouTube called “Clinton Cash” for a disturbing contrast.

you may get your fervent wish, as Trump appears to be gaining in the polls, and we may have to contend with the nightmare of his presidency.

This is an unfair thing to say. Please show me some respect and common courtesy by not making such a disrespectful comment. In what way do I have a “fervent wish” to have Trump be elected? Trump may be gaining in the polls, but there is a very strong case to be made that even the town drunk would be able to trounce someone as despicable as Trump. The fact that Hillary is NOT trouncing him in the polls is largely due to Hillary’s understandably extreme lack of appeal. The only way someone as disgusting as Trump has a chance to win is to be running against someone who is so flawed. It is Hillary and those who have voted for her that are to blame for Trump having a chance.

Many of us on the left are also convinced that a Hillary presidency would be a nightmare. For example, I believe Clinton is in many ways far more dangerous because no one will oppose her when she starts new “wars on terror,” or further deregulates Wall Street, or ramps up the ruinous war on drugs, or ramps up fracking/drilling, or pours more money into the Pentagon while cutting social programs. Why? Because Republicans love those things! And Democrats and activists will, as w/ Obama, give her a free pass to engage in these mistakes because such mistakes are being done by a Dem prez. By contrast, if Trump is president, the Democrats will more likely fight him tooth and nail if he proposes such atrocities.

BTW, I have noticed something very frustrating in this election: Hillary is benefitting from the “Teflon Protection Plan” (very few allegations stick to her, no matter how credible or numerous). I have not seen this much Teflon since Ronald Reagan benefitted from it in the 1980s. Hillary, in the view of many on the left, has an enormous number of awful flaws. Teflon is therefore needed to have the left wing vote for her. A short list of her flaws: She is shockingly corrupt (indeed, so much so that it is highly likely she will be impeached if she is elected). She and her husband are UNBELIEVABLY wealthy (net worth of the family is now on the order of $200 million, after being mostly bankrupt at the end of Bill’s term of office). She is a very outspoken warmonger (a huge number of right-wing hawks such as Kissinger support her). She holds a shocking number of right-wing views (see above list). Her campaign has provided the following Teflon tactics to allow left-wing voters to look the other way and pay no attention to the man/woman behind the curtain:

  1. “Hillary is slightly flawed, BUT TRUMP IS FAR WORSE!”
  2. “Hillary has never been indicted/imprisoned despite decades of attacks and allegations. That means we can safely assume that all of the allegations about her email fiasco exposed by WikiLeaks, the corruption of the Clinton Foundation, her past votes and statements, and her cozy relationships w/ unsavory characters can ALL be dismissed, as they will surely be shown to be false eventually.”
  3. “You are a Hillary Hater, which is likely due to the fact that you are a sexist.”
  4. “THE RUSSIANS ARE BEHIND THIS! (shame on the Dems for their frequent red-baiting these days) REPUBLICANS ARE THE SOURCE OF THIS! TRUMP SAID IT!” This is the shameful “blame the messenger” and “pay no attention to the message” game.
  5. “Hillary has done so much in the past for women and children!”
  6. “Enough with the damn emails!”
  7. Hillary is a world champion flip flopper on issues (to advance herself politically or monetarily). She changes her positions on issues so regularly that it makes my head spin, which means it is incredibly easy for her supporters to claim she does not support X or Y or Z anymore, even though she did last week.
  8. “I’m too busy to evaluate all of these claims against Hillary.”

I highly disrespect all I have seen you post on facebook recently. I believe you have lost a lot of respect with your constant diatribes against Hillary Clinton.

The coincidence is that I highly disrespect the many posts from the FB friends I have who I thought were on the left, but as it turns out are voting for Republican Hillary. I am hugely disappointed to see them repeatedly posting support for a far right winger like Hillary. And with all due respect, I am very disappointed in your disrespecting me by posting these disdainful comments about me – in front of my FB friends — on my FB wall. I have not ever posted disrespectful comments about you or your views on your FB wall. It is not okay for you to do that to me. Please refrain from doing so in the future. Please show some common courtesy.

In closing…

Given what they have done this year, I am furious about the DNC. They strongly supported the Dem primary candidate (Hillary) who was LEAST LIKELY to beat Trump (all other Dem candidates, in polls, were WAY ahead of Trump). We have learned from WikiLeaks, BTW, that the DNC was supporting Hillary and working against other Dem candidates as far back as January 2015, but dishonestly making it seem like they were being supportive of all Dem candidates. And by nominating someone who is so far to the political right, the DNC has destroyed many friendships and alliances on the left. People on the left, who were formerly friends and political allies of others on the left, now disrespect and dislike each other as some are lining up strongly supportive of Hillary and some are strongly opposed to Hillary (those for and against Hillary HATE the fact that friends or loved ones are for or against her). This toxicity is tearing the Democratic Party apart. Both major parties are in trouble after this election, given who they have nominated.

I hope to remain your friend despite what the DNC has done.

This election, more than any I recall in the past, has been poisonous. It has turned many of us against friends and loved ones. I wish we directed as much hostility toward societal problems as we do toward friends these days.



[My friend responded to the above. Below is my response to her response.]

  1. I will agree to posting one piece bashing Trump as soon as you agree to posting one piece bashing Hillary. I despise Trump, but having said that, I am fair-minded enough to realize that there has never been a more brutal, comprehensive media bashing of a candidate in my entire life than the one the media is engaged in against Trump. Every article I see in the Camera bashes Trump and excuses Hillary. It is shockingly biased.
  2. It saddens me that you continue to disrespect me by suggesting I want Trump to win. Would I rather have a catastrophe in five days or three days? If those are my “choices,” I don’t have a choice. My only “choice” is neither.  https://domdangerous.wordpress.com/2016/10/01/hillarys-campaign-slogan-ill-drive-america-off-a-cliff-in-five-days-my-opponent-will-do-it-in-three-days/
  3. I’m taking a privileged, white, comfortable position? I have read this argument several times in the past and am not at all sympathetic to it. For example, it is absurd to think that voting for multimillionaire 1%er Hillary is supportive of lower income folks. It is absurd to think that voting for Hillary, who has been utterly corrupted by millions of Wall St/Banker money (and has been exposed as admitting her corruption by WikiLeaks) will be good for lower-income folks. It is absurd to think that voting for warmonger Hillary (who is supported by most right-wing war hawks because Trump is too much of an isolationist) will be good for the lower-income folks who are being killed and PTSD’d in US wars of aggression. It is absurd to think that non-straight folks are okay with a woman who has had a long career of opposition to LBGT rights.
  4. It is obscene to suggest that someone on the left such as myself must be “responsible” and vote for a Republican like Hillary. Doing THAT is abdicating my responsibility to make our world better. I will NEVER vote Republican, even if the opponent is, say, Nixon. There are real consequences for Dems to vote for a Repub for president. More murderous and endless wars against civilians. Less regulation of Wall Street. More fracking and drilling. More “war on drugs” insanity than we have today. More obscene Pentagon spending. More people imprisoned. Those are real consequences. Shame on any Dem for voting for more of those atrocious things. If I have a “choice” to vote for someone who will kill one million civilians or two million, it is NOT “responsible” for me to vote for the one who will “only” kill one million. Those one million are real people. Those are real consequences.
  5. My position is purist? That claim is utterly laughable. On my list of the top 15 or 20 issues, Hillary does not support any of them. She scores a zero on my top issues. Being a purist is to be someone not voting for a person because that person “only” supports 14 of your top 15 issues. Voting for Hillary is therefore throwing away my vote. Voting for Hillary also sends the message that I think the 2-party system is fine and dandy. It also sends the message that the Dem Party should keep nominating Republicans like Hillary in the future.
  6. If the Repubs win the presidency and senate, the blame is with the DNC and those supporting right wing candidates such as Hillary. The Dems nominating a right wing candidate is a great recipe for having millions of voters on the left either vote for Third Party or not vote at all. How can we explain the fact that Trump — the most awful candidate in US history — is polling close to Hillary? My dog would poll better against someone as horrible as Trump. Could it possibly be that Hillary is corrupt, dishonest, and an overall disgusting person?no-lives-matter

A Trump OR Hillary presidency would be BAD. VERY bad. If you pick the better of two shit sandwiches, you will keep being offered shit sandwiches. — Unknown




Filed under Politics

2 responses to “A Conversation with a Friend and Political Ally about the 2016 Prez Race

  1. “If you pick the better of two shit sandwiches, you will keep being offered shit sandwiches.” — Exactly! (Give blood. 😉 )

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s